Naked Men Talking: Tom O'Kelly
In the conversation, we talk historical accuracy, the drama of dating apps, and why he was afraid of his masculinity.
For our podcast, Naked Men Talking, I caught up with Tom O'Kelly whose show, Remember, Remember! is currently on at Edinburgh Fringe.
In the conversation, we talk historical accuracy, the drama of dating apps, and why he was afraid of his masculinity.
Remember, Remember! is a musical retelling of the story of the Gunpowder Plot. Why is this a story that will resonate with today's audiences?
The main focus of the story is really about a friend-group and about relationships. We're not very loyal to the true story of the Gunpowder Plot. It's just this funny insight into relations in a friend-group and the different personalities and how they affect each other - you've seen those dynamics with people that you know.
We're not here to teach history, we're here to do some choreography.
You're about a week into the run - is everything going to plan?
We just had our day off yesterday, which was beyond needed.
We're very lucky that we have sold out of every show so far - that has been beyond our wildest dreams. We did not think that would ever happen.
This is our very first fringe. I've actually only been to Edinburgh one time in my life before this. This is kind of a baptism of fire.
By Fringe standards, we're in a pretty big venue - we have 175 seats. The pressure of trying to sell that every day has been playing on my mind, but it's been going very well.
The only sort of downside of this is that it is a lot of pressure - our voices are going and we're just all a bit fatigued, but you want to give the best performance for everyone because they deserve it.
How did you first discover and start to explore your passion for performing and being on stage?
I started very young. I'm from Belfast. When I was growing up, there was a community group called Fort William Musical Society - I started there. We were a bunch of working class kids from Belfast doing productions of Fiddler on the Roof and Hello Dolly. By the time I was 10, I had been in two productions of Anything Goes. I was a full-blown theatre-kid.
How did that passion for performing intersect with your sexuality as you were growing up?
Because I started doing theatre so young, it was always a part of my thing and I had a really affirmed established sense of self from a young age.
I had this amazing group of friends - theatre kids feel things very intensely so you have these intimate relationships from a very young age. My parents were very supportive.
I had never been afraid of my femininity growing up - that was never an unknown feature for me. If anything, I was afraid of my masculinity - that's a whole other story. I didn't come into that until well into my twenties.
I knew I was gay from a very young age. I think I came out to my friends when I was 13. I actually never came out to my family because I didn't need to.
In terms of my sexuality and performing, it's absolutely intertwined.
Personally, I knew who I was. My friends knew who I was, it was never a secret. But sexually, I kissed like two boys from the ages of fifteen to twenty one.
I was so blindingly confident in the areas that I was confident in and so insecure personally as a sexual being.
What was fuelling that insecurity?
I've always had female friends my whole life. I have a lot of male friends now, but I didn't all the way until I had finished uni. I finished uni when I was twenty five - I did five years.
I've always been insecure in my body. I'm really not there yet.
I've always been very femme, but I've been coming into my own body in the last few years and recognising that I'm really tall and I'm really broad shouldered. It's hard when people are only into that and not into me. Are you attracted to me as Tom? Or do you just really like my body because you like that body?
Sometimes that doesn't matter?
I think I'm not there yet mentally with my own body to accept that. It feels like their intentions are not pure.
What's shifted for you in terms of building a better relationship with your body?
It's finding a lot more friends, male friends, gay male friends, and seeing more of their bodies celebrated. Seeing that it's really not that deep. That has helped me just come out of my head a bit.
Even with dating apps - before I had male friends - I would over-dramatise it so much, and make it this deep and important thing, that sex is a sacred thing. There's something very Christian about that - I grew up in a very Irish Catholic household.
In the last year, I've become vers - a vers-top really. Before, I thought that I was incapable of topping - I genuinely was incapable of doing it.
It's all psychological.
Beyond Edinburgh, what's on your vision-board?
We're going back to London to the Pleasance in November for a two-week run or Remember, Remember! That's very exciting. The next big goal is to find a producer for the show - it would be beyond a dream to take this show on tour and to do a sit-down production for a couple of months.
Personally, life is very transitional. I'm at the end of my twenties. I've accepted that I know nothing.
I want to do jobs that I really want to do. My focus is on finding work that makes me feel excited.
I'm also doing my Christmas cabaret this Christmas with my sister, Sioned. We do it in in Belfast - we're called the Jingle Belles.
What do you hope that people feel when they come to see Remember, Remember!?
I hope they fucking enjoy it. I really do. It's a funny show. It's very irreverent. It's very naughty. I hope they leave humming the songs. I just hope that they they love it.
Remember, Remember! is on at Pleasance Dome until 30 August
Gareth Johnson